About 4,000 years ago, nomads called the Ai-Lao (as the Thais were called by the Chinese) settled in West-Central Asia, having fought their way up from the Indian continent. Their federation of Kingdoms grew and flourished until 200 B.C., when the Han-dynasty of China began their wars of expansion. Vastly outnumbered, the Ai- Lao managed to hold off wave after invading armies, thanks mainly to their great skill with weapons, but eventually, the greater numbers of the Chinese won out and the Ai-Lao became vassals to the Szechuan-empire. Rather than live under Chinese rule many of the Ai-Lao gradually migrated south into the forests and jungles of Southeast Asia. The wandering Ai-Lao-people divided into three branches; The Shans who settled in Burma, The Ahom who went East into Vietnam and the Lao-Tai who wandered into Laos. By the 7th Century A.D, the Ai-Lao tribes still in China had become the so-called independent Kingdom of Nanchao. And for the next 100 years, Nanchao and China were constantly at war usually as enemies, but occasionally as allies against the Tibetan tribes to the west. (One Tibetan tribe in particular, the Burmans later became Thailand's worst enemy). By the end of the 9th century, Nanchao had been absorbed into the Chinese empire but at the same time, the first Thai states were forming into today's Laos and Siam, the name of ancient Thailand.
The Ai-Lao became a powerful force, ready to expand and conquer. By the year 1350, northern Siam and Most of Laos was united into Kingdom of Lan Xang and prince Uthong of Ayudhhya began a new dynasty, which was to last for 400 years. This was the Golden Age of Thailand, but with its prosperity came constant warfare against the Burmese to the west and the Khmers to the South East. To ensure the survial of their country, the great warriors of the nation were brought together and distilled the vast combat- knowledge of their people into a training-method called the Chupasart. Because the methods of combat-training were recorded and kept up to date, the martial art of Thailand never fragmented into different styles and systems. There were improvements and innovations added to the text, but every change was first proven on the battlefield or in the ring.
http://www.observergroup.net/ob95back/thismonth.htm
Full Version: History of Muay Thai
it doesn't smell right.
It's khmer,it's lao,it's burma,no..it's vietnam. Heck,it's american! Whatever it is,it's just not Thai.
QUOTE(erla @ May 7 2007, 02:31 AM) [snapback]2928349[/snapback]
It's khmer,it's lao,it's burma,no..it's vietnam. Heck,it's american! Whatever it is,it's just not Thai.
Its Hmong!!
really now? 
Mauy Thai is pirate martial art. Sagat has an eye patch.
QUOTE
Mauy Thai is pirate martial art. Sagat has an eye patch.
hahahaha. Street Fighter
there was an old man who was a great fighter. he told me that martial arts and common sense and logic are all the same.
you work into ur mucles the instinctive movement that is best for every situation.
these movements have been studied and molded for many thousands of years to become wat they are today.
professional martial artists say everything goes your way untill you get hit. that is because you stop thinking, because they are not trained enough so the body moves by itself when they see a certin style or stance. their body should predict wat possible things may happen and move ahead. that is martial arts. making ur body fight smart. basicly
so if u think about it that way. how can soemone invent a martial art? there is probably someone 1000 miles away that thought about the fighting style be4 the home country we think came from has it today.
you work into ur mucles the instinctive movement that is best for every situation.
these movements have been studied and molded for many thousands of years to become wat they are today.
professional martial artists say everything goes your way untill you get hit. that is because you stop thinking, because they are not trained enough so the body moves by itself when they see a certin style or stance. their body should predict wat possible things may happen and move ahead. that is martial arts. making ur body fight smart. basicly
so if u think about it that way. how can soemone invent a martial art? there is probably someone 1000 miles away that thought about the fighting style be4 the home country we think came from has it today.
QUOTE(erla @ May 7 2007, 03:31 AM) [snapback]2928349[/snapback]
It's khmer,it's lao,it's burma,no..it's vietnam. Heck,it's american! Whatever it is,it's just not Thai.
its asian
QUOTE(CyberTerrorist @ May 6 2007, 07:42 PM) [snapback]2927869[/snapback]
About 4,000 years ago, nomads called the Ai-Lao (as the Thais were called by the Chinese) settled in West-Central Asia, having fought their way up from the Indian continent. Their federation of Kingdoms grew and flourished until 200 B.C., when the Han-dynasty of China began their wars of expansion. Vastly outnumbered, the Ai- Lao managed to hold off wave after invading armies, thanks mainly to their great skill with weapons, but eventually, the greater numbers of the Chinese won out and the Ai-Lao became vassals to the Szechuan-empire. Rather than live under Chinese rule many of the Ai-Lao gradually migrated south into the forests and jungles of Southeast Asia. The wandering Ai-Lao-people divided into three branches; The Shans who settled in Burma, The Ahom who went East into Vietnam and the Lao-Tai who wandered into Laos. By the 7th Century A.D, the Ai-Lao tribes still in China had become the so-called independent Kingdom of Nanchao. And for the next 100 years, Nanchao and China were constantly at war usually as enemies, but occasionally as allies against the Tibetan tribes to the west. (One Tibetan tribe in particular, the Burmans later became Thailand's worst enemy). By the end of the 9th century, Nanchao had been absorbed into the Chinese empire but at the same time, the first Thai states were forming into today's Laos and Siam, the name of ancient Thailand.
The Ai-Lao became a powerful force, ready to expand and conquer. By the year 1350, northern Siam and Most of Laos was united into Kingdom of Lan Xang and prince Uthong of Ayudhhya began a new dynasty, which was to last for 400 years. This was the Golden Age of Thailand, but with its prosperity came constant warfare against the Burmese to the west and the Khmers to the South East. To ensure the survial of their country, the great warriors of the nation were brought together and distilled the vast combat- knowledge of their people into a training-method called the Chupasart. Because the methods of combat-training were recorded and kept up to date, the martial art of Thailand never fragmented into different styles and systems. There were improvements and innovations added to the text, but every change was first proven on the battlefield or in the ring.
http://www.observergroup.net/ob95back/thismonth.htm
Its a street fighting art that everyone does around the world.
The Ai-Lao became a powerful force, ready to expand and conquer. By the year 1350, northern Siam and Most of Laos was united into Kingdom of Lan Xang and prince Uthong of Ayudhhya began a new dynasty, which was to last for 400 years. This was the Golden Age of Thailand, but with its prosperity came constant warfare against the Burmese to the west and the Khmers to the South East. To ensure the survial of their country, the great warriors of the nation were brought together and distilled the vast combat- knowledge of their people into a training-method called the Chupasart. Because the methods of combat-training were recorded and kept up to date, the martial art of Thailand never fragmented into different styles and systems. There were improvements and innovations added to the text, but every change was first proven on the battlefield or in the ring.
http://www.observergroup.net/ob95back/thismonth.htm
Its a street fighting art that everyone does around the world.
ITs khmer. 
Khmers were the masters of south east asia. Everything khmer predates thai. Thais had much influence from khmers. I dont know why they try to claim it as their own art. Muay is not even word in thai i think. In khmer it means one.
Khmers were the masters of south east asia. Everything khmer predates thai. Thais had much influence from khmers. I dont know why they try to claim it as their own art. Muay is not even word in thai i think. In khmer it means one.
It's Russian.
QUOTE(Lite Khmai @ May 10 2007, 12:08 PM) [snapback]2935199[/snapback]
ITs khmer. Khmers were the masters of south east asia. Everything khmer predates thai. Thais had much influence from khmers. I dont know why they try to claim it as their own art. Muay is not even word in thai i think. In khmer it means one.
Khmers were the masters of south east asia. Everything khmer predates thai. Thais had much influence from khmers. I dont know why they try to claim it as their own art. Muay is not even word in thai i think. In khmer it means one.Muay means art of fighting in Thai . lolz.......
My thoughts,
Since the thai and khmer were living together during the reign of the khmer empire in SEA...of course the two groups of people will have to share the same culture. So when Siem rebelled against the khmers and formed their own kingdom, they decided to use a fighting style to defend themselves, if they lost their weapons during battles. This art which is Muay Thai, was influenced by their khmer counter-part and others.
My friend said that Muay Thai was also influenced by western boxing.
So basically, Muay Thai was influenced by the khmer art of Bokator/Pradal Serey and other arts around the world.
Yes, Muay Thai and Pradal Serey are very similar, but they are not the same.
It is widely speculated that the khmers were the originators of SEA boxing, as decipted by carvings on the many temples in Southeast Asia, and that all other similar martial arts in the region were influenced by them.
I am Khmer, but i just want to say that the reasons why others look down on us, is because we like to claim many things belong to our people. Yes, it bums me out that they don't give some credit to Cambodia for their art, but wouldn't it be cool if Pradal Serey and Muay Thai were competeing against each other to see which art is better. If we concentrate on letting the world find out about Pradal Serey, we can be as popular as Muay Thai. I know our art is as good as Muay Thai, maybe even better.
Answer this question, would we be claiming Muay Thai was ours, if it wasn't that popular, would we be claiming Tonj Jaa was khmer, if he was a no name martial artist. The answer would be no.
The reason why we claim things to be ours, is because we want to be known for something, and you know it.
Us khmers are already known for our vast history and culture, we should be happy that other countries in SEA are influenced by us. Look at Thailand, their alphabet, dance, gestures, and many other things, were influenced by Cambodia, which was influenced by India.
I don't think they "stole" our culture, they just were influenced.
Since the thai and khmer were living together during the reign of the khmer empire in SEA...of course the two groups of people will have to share the same culture. So when Siem rebelled against the khmers and formed their own kingdom, they decided to use a fighting style to defend themselves, if they lost their weapons during battles. This art which is Muay Thai, was influenced by their khmer counter-part and others.
My friend said that Muay Thai was also influenced by western boxing.
So basically, Muay Thai was influenced by the khmer art of Bokator/Pradal Serey and other arts around the world.
Yes, Muay Thai and Pradal Serey are very similar, but they are not the same.
It is widely speculated that the khmers were the originators of SEA boxing, as decipted by carvings on the many temples in Southeast Asia, and that all other similar martial arts in the region were influenced by them.
I am Khmer, but i just want to say that the reasons why others look down on us, is because we like to claim many things belong to our people. Yes, it bums me out that they don't give some credit to Cambodia for their art, but wouldn't it be cool if Pradal Serey and Muay Thai were competeing against each other to see which art is better. If we concentrate on letting the world find out about Pradal Serey, we can be as popular as Muay Thai. I know our art is as good as Muay Thai, maybe even better.
Answer this question, would we be claiming Muay Thai was ours, if it wasn't that popular, would we be claiming Tonj Jaa was khmer, if he was a no name martial artist. The answer would be no.
The reason why we claim things to be ours, is because we want to be known for something, and you know it.
Us khmers are already known for our vast history and culture, we should be happy that other countries in SEA are influenced by us. Look at Thailand, their alphabet, dance, gestures, and many other things, were influenced by Cambodia, which was influenced by India.
I don't think they "stole" our culture, they just were influenced.
it's time to be serious
it's came from indian ancestral fighting art!!! even java's style look like indian style
for sure muay thai is from khmer who bring it from indian style too
but for sure it's a buddhism fighting style
it's came from indian ancestral fighting art!!! even java's style look like indian style
for sure muay thai is from khmer who bring it from indian style too
but for sure it's a buddhism fighting style
..
QUOTE(DJTherkTrei @ May 10 2007, 09:02 PM) [snapback]2935768[/snapback]
My thoughts,
Since the thai and khmer were living together during the reign of the khmer empire in SEA...of course the two groups of people will have to share the same culture. So when Siem rebelled against the khmers and formed their own kingdom, they decided to use a fighting style to defend themselves, if they lost their weapons during battles. This art which is Muay Thai, was influenced by their khmer counter-part and others.
Since the thai and khmer were living together during the reign of the khmer empire in SEA...of course the two groups of people will have to share the same culture. So when Siem rebelled against the khmers and formed their own kingdom, they decided to use a fighting style to defend themselves, if they lost their weapons during battles. This art which is Muay Thai, was influenced by their khmer counter-part and others.
I know this sounds like a brokern record, but I thought Siamese are Khmer ppl?
no where in any ancient manuscript says that Siamese are of T'ai orgin, or says they came from the Northern Territories where the T'ai ppl arrived from?
all the evidence i have ever seen points that they are khmer?
so as one member has mentioned many times, Muay Thai is Muay Siamese which is Muay Khmer, they are all in the same, and the more i look into it, I do believe what he says is true,
just from the evidence i have seen, maybe there is evidence out there that says Siamese are T'ai, but i have not yet seen it
i dont care who came up with it, it is pretty cool
Siem = Thailand
Siem People = Thai people
The Thais migrated from Southern China to SEA in waves, and some lived with the Khmers, while others lived in other parts of Southeast Asia. There is proof that they came from Southern China.
The thais are not khmer as you can tell by what I wrote above. Let me explain to you more.
During the later years of the Khmer Empire, a few generals in the Empire, who happens to be thai, rebelled and formed their own kingdom as I said in my last post, and formed the first Thai Nation.
That's why there is a Thailand.
Siem is just another word for Thailand or the Thai people.
Muay Thai was heavily influenced by Bokator/Pradal Serey, but not exactly the same.
Siem People = Thai people
The Thais migrated from Southern China to SEA in waves, and some lived with the Khmers, while others lived in other parts of Southeast Asia. There is proof that they came from Southern China.
The thais are not khmer as you can tell by what I wrote above. Let me explain to you more.
During the later years of the Khmer Empire, a few generals in the Empire, who happens to be thai, rebelled and formed their own kingdom as I said in my last post, and formed the first Thai Nation.
That's why there is a Thailand.
Siem is just another word for Thailand or the Thai people.
Muay Thai was heavily influenced by Bokator/Pradal Serey, but not exactly the same.
^This chick gots some balls.... i commend your for that.
You got a good point in the anceint manuscript argument.
I too looked for old Thai or Siamese manuscript written about there history, and i did find some.
Heres the shock and awe: those manuscripts are written in "Khom" and any literate Khmer person can read it.
You got a good point in the anceint manuscript argument.
I too looked for old Thai or Siamese manuscript written about there history, and i did find some.
Heres the shock and awe: those manuscripts are written in "Khom" and any literate Khmer person can read it.
The Thais lived with the Khmer for a long time.
They had to learn their culture.
They had to learn their culture.
QUOTE(DJTherkTrei @ May 10 2007, 10:19 PM) [snapback]2935887[/snapback]
Siem = Thailand
Siem People = Thai people
The Thais migrated from Southern China to SEA in waves, and some lived with the Khmers, while others lived in other parts of Southeast Asia. There is proof that they came from Southern China.
The thais are not khmer as you can tell by what I wrote above. Let me explain to you more.
During the later years of the Khmer Empire, a few generals in the Empire, who happens to be thai, rebelled and formed their own kingdom as I said in my last post, and formed the first Thai Nation.
That's why there is a Thailand.
Siem is just another word for Thailand or the Thai people.
Muay Thai was heavily influenced by Bokator/Pradal Serey, but not exactly the same.
Siem People = Thai people
The Thais migrated from Southern China to SEA in waves, and some lived with the Khmers, while others lived in other parts of Southeast Asia. There is proof that they came from Southern China.
The thais are not khmer as you can tell by what I wrote above. Let me explain to you more.
During the later years of the Khmer Empire, a few generals in the Empire, who happens to be thai, rebelled and formed their own kingdom as I said in my last post, and formed the first Thai Nation.
That's why there is a Thailand.
Siem is just another word for Thailand or the Thai people.
Muay Thai was heavily influenced by Bokator/Pradal Serey, but not exactly the same.
Siamese means in Sankrit "Dark Skin People"
T'ai ppl from Southern China are Light Skin Ppl, just look at northern thailand and Northern Laos general population,
where does that connect? there seems to be a contradiction
if the T'ai are in general light skin ppl from the north, How does Siamese which means "Dark Skin People" refer to the light skin T'ai ppl that come from the North?
there is where im a bit confused,
Yes there is evidence that some Thais come from Southern China, but there is evidence that Siamese come from Khmer empire,
Did those Thais who conquered china come straight from China, or did they slowly migrate from Northern Thailand and Northern Laos? just a question
I assume ur talking about Sukothai? and RamKhamHeung, So where did RamKhamHeung come from? straight from China?
so as u said, if Sukothai is the first Thai Kingdom, I assume that Lanna was not a Thai Kingdom? since Lanna was formed before Sukothai.
Just few questions for us to look at, and pounder on,
for me, if the general population of thailand are siamese, then in general we are Khmer ppl. We as in the general discription of Thai ppl.
Sorry to correct you, but I believe Lanna actually came a couple more years after Sukothai.
You make some good arguments, and somehow I'm starting to think Siamese are a mix of Khmer and Thai blood, but in general terms, Siamese is another way to say Thai People.
I hope to adds some more thoughts in, but right now I feel like sleeping, so congratz on all your interesting thoughts.
You make some good arguments, and somehow I'm starting to think Siamese are a mix of Khmer and Thai blood, but in general terms, Siamese is another way to say Thai People.
I hope to adds some more thoughts in, but right now I feel like sleeping, so congratz on all your interesting thoughts.
Whats also not pointed out in Thai history but is pointed out in Khmer history is that Khun Pha Muang, one of the founders of Sukothai was the son in law to King Jayavarman the VIII. His wifes name was Sikara Maha Devi. The Lao counterpart of Lan Xang, King Fa Ngum was also the son in law of Jayavarman, he married Neang Keo Kaliyan.
The Angkor Kingdom was under pressure of the Mongolian horde at that time. Jayavarmans first intentions was to help setup those kingdoms as a buffer zone. He sent his own troops to Lan Xang and "Siem" mercenaries to Sukothai. Then that all became history.
Later on in history Nuerosun, we call him Phreah Nero, sacked Lovek for its populace. War Torn Ayuthaya was in desperate need of population after the wars with Burma. Those who escaped Lovek left written accounts of an exodus of Khmer people and the 2 iconic relices preah ko preah keo to the Chao Praya basin. The Thai version of history claims that the sack of Lovek was due to the Khmers King betrayal. Preah Nero beheaded the Khmer king and washed his feet with the blood. The Khmer version had actually manuscripst of him finding refuge in Laos, and Lao manuscripts supports it also.
Khmers knew all along that the khmer Populace co-existed WITHIN Thai existence from the first their kingdom on. That why things that we universally share like Kick boxing, our martial arts masters would like to call it Sovanaphum boxing, which belongs to the golden trinity, Khmer, Lao, Thai. But Thailand chooses make it exclusive by calling it mauy Thai.
I can't wait for someone to hack Jasel's account and lock this thread then make it mysterouslly dissapear.
The Angkor Kingdom was under pressure of the Mongolian horde at that time. Jayavarmans first intentions was to help setup those kingdoms as a buffer zone. He sent his own troops to Lan Xang and "Siem" mercenaries to Sukothai. Then that all became history.
Later on in history Nuerosun, we call him Phreah Nero, sacked Lovek for its populace. War Torn Ayuthaya was in desperate need of population after the wars with Burma. Those who escaped Lovek left written accounts of an exodus of Khmer people and the 2 iconic relices preah ko preah keo to the Chao Praya basin. The Thai version of history claims that the sack of Lovek was due to the Khmers King betrayal. Preah Nero beheaded the Khmer king and washed his feet with the blood. The Khmer version had actually manuscripst of him finding refuge in Laos, and Lao manuscripts supports it also.
Khmers knew all along that the khmer Populace co-existed WITHIN Thai existence from the first their kingdom on. That why things that we universally share like Kick boxing, our martial arts masters would like to call it Sovanaphum boxing, which belongs to the golden trinity, Khmer, Lao, Thai. But Thailand chooses make it exclusive by calling it mauy Thai.
I can't wait for someone to hack Jasel's account and lock this thread then make it mysterouslly dissapear.
QUOTE(Point_Dexter @ May 10 2007, 07:27 PM) [snapback]2935904[/snapback]
^This chick gots some balls.... i commend your for that.
You got a good point in the anceint manuscript argument.
I too looked for old Thai or Siamese manuscript written about there history, and i did find some.
Heres the shock and awe: those manuscripts are written in "Khom" and any literate Khmer person can read it.
You got a good point in the anceint manuscript argument.
I too looked for old Thai or Siamese manuscript written about there history, and i did find some.
Heres the shock and awe: those manuscripts are written in "Khom" and any literate Khmer person can read it.
I've seen siri post old old thai manuscripts for 'how to build temples' written in khmer too.
QUOTE(GraceJao @ May 10 2007, 07:38 PM) [snapback]2935926[/snapback]
Siamese means in Sankrit "Dark Skin People"
T'ai ppl from Southern China are Light Skin Ppl, just look at northern thailand and Northern Laos general population,
where does that connect? there seems to be a contradiction
if the T'ai are in general light skin ppl from the north, How does Siamese which means "Dark Skin People" refer to the light skin T'ai ppl that come from the North?
there is where im a bit confused,
Yes there is evidence that some Thais come from Southern China, but there is evidence that Siamese come from Khmer empire,
Did those Thais who conquered china come straight from China, or did they slowly migrate from Northern Thailand and Northern Laos? just a question
I assume ur talking about Sukothai? and RamKhamHeung, So where did RamKhamHeung come from? straight from China?
so as u said, if Sukothai is the first Thai Kingdom, I assume that Lanna was not a Thai Kingdom? since Lanna was formed before Sukothai.
Just few questions for us to look at, and pounder on,
for me, if the general population of thailand are siamese, then in general we are Khmer ppl. We as in the general discription of Thai ppl.
T'ai ppl from Southern China are Light Skin Ppl, just look at northern thailand and Northern Laos general population,
where does that connect? there seems to be a contradiction
if the T'ai are in general light skin ppl from the north, How does Siamese which means "Dark Skin People" refer to the light skin T'ai ppl that come from the North?
there is where im a bit confused,
Yes there is evidence that some Thais come from Southern China, but there is evidence that Siamese come from Khmer empire,
Did those Thais who conquered china come straight from China, or did they slowly migrate from Northern Thailand and Northern Laos? just a question
I assume ur talking about Sukothai? and RamKhamHeung, So where did RamKhamHeung come from? straight from China?
so as u said, if Sukothai is the first Thai Kingdom, I assume that Lanna was not a Thai Kingdom? since Lanna was formed before Sukothai.
Just few questions for us to look at, and pounder on,
for me, if the general population of thailand are siamese, then in general we are Khmer ppl. We as in the general discription of Thai ppl.
Mman for the record siem is what us khmers call thai people. Ask any khmer they will tell you that. And is it just me or most thai's I encountered are dark skinned (I thought they came from s. china). Don't let the media in Thailand fool you.
QUOTE(cambosoup @ May 10 2007, 11:39 PM) [snapback]2936214[/snapback]
Mman for the record siem is what us khmers call thai people. Ask any khmer they will tell you that. And is it just me or most thai's I encountered are dark skinned (I thought they came from s. china). Don't let the media in Thailand fool you.
Cambosoup, this is the face of a real Siamese-Thai. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kClcqHIunG0 This is not the Chinese-Thai or the Falang-Thai face that we normally see. This is the real deal.
QUOTE(cambosoup @ May 10 2007, 11:39 PM) [snapback]2936214[/snapback]
Mman for the record siem is what us khmers call thai people. Ask any khmer they will tell you that. And is it just me or most thai's I encountered are dark skinned (I thought they came from s. china). Don't let the media in Thailand fool you.
you are confusing Thai with Tai my friend.
QUOTE(thepimpraja @ May 10 2007, 10:28 PM) [snapback]2936298[/snapback]
Cambosoup, this is the face of a real Siamese-Thai. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kClcqHIunG0 This is not the Chinese-Thai or the Falang-Thai face that we normally see. This is the real deal.
Yes that's what I been trying to tell these fools. Most Thais I met are that skin tone. I'm sick of people saying Khmers, flips and Indonesians are dark when most Thais has the same skin tone.
indonesians are dark? the indonesians ive met looked mixed, kinda like central thai mixed.
QUOTE(babyshanker @ May 10 2007, 11:06 PM) [snapback]2936391[/snapback]
indonesians are dark? the indonesians ive met looked mixed, kinda like central thai mixed.
Yeah man have you seen the Tsunami coverage in Indonesia where they show the people. man they could pass for cambodians anyday. Do you know a pornstar name Jade Marcela she looks khmer too. Plus they are right on the equator go figure. And again don't let the media fool you in Indonesia or Thailand.
a lot of my indonesian friends and the ones i've met are actually 2nd, 3rd generation chinese or mixed. they are mostly international students and came to the states because of the anti-chinese riots.
QUOTE(thepimpraja @ May 10 2007, 10:28 PM) [snapback]2936298[/snapback]
Cambosoup, this is the face of a real Siamese-Thai. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kClcqHIunG0 This is not the Chinese-Thai or the Falang-Thai face that we normally see. This is the real deal.
How do you know this guy isn't khmer surin?
these girls posted in this thread look similar to the indonesians i know. i think they are the same type of indonesians crew described. http://www.asiafinest.com/forum/index.php?...772&st=2300
QUOTE(thepimpraja @ May 11 2007, 12:28 AM) [snapback]2936298[/snapback]
Cambosoup, this is the face of a real Siamese-Thai. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kClcqHIunG0 This is not the Chinese-Thai or the Falang-Thai face that we normally see. This is the real deal.
is that dude singin an isan song? kinda looks like mike piromporn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XYeZQ2tcv4
HOT! indonesia is very diverse. the ones from the link look very central thai and central thai's tend to be very mixed.
QUOTE(babyshanker @ May 10 2007, 11:57 PM) [snapback]2936513[/snapback]
is that dude singin an isan song? kinda looks like mike piromporn http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XYeZQ2tcv4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XYeZQ2tcv4The media is always going to show you light skinned celebrities and pretty faces. Even cambodia is like that with their celebs but that doesn't mean the the majority of the citizens are like that. And i agree Indonesians are very diverse, perhaps the most diverse country in SE Asia.
I notice that there are no Thai people engaging in this conversation at all except GraceJao. Where are the Thai scholars and warriors? In my opinion, the art of boxing is shared by Cambodia, Thailand and Laos. Why can't it be call something else besides Mauy Thai. Why can't it be called Freestyle Boxing? Khmer people don't call it Prodal Khmer but chose to call it Prodal Serey (Freestyle Boxing). It was a gift to all who practice the art not be exclusive by one country or people.
People should shut this thread down because it is an old argument that goes nowhere and it annoyed everyone.
People should shut this thread down because it is an old argument that goes nowhere and it annoyed everyone.
banned
banned
I agree with Lemongrass, the arts like Pradal Serey, Muay Thai, Muay Lao, and any other should be universally known as "SEA Boxing", they are all extremely similar, just a few tweaks and modifications. But I'm pretty sure that wont's happen anytime soon.
Anyone here like Mahori music?
QUOTE(DJTherkTrei @ May 10 2007, 08:01 PM) [snapback]2935986[/snapback]
Sorry to correct you, but I believe Lanna actually came a couple more years after Sukothai.
You make some good arguments, and somehow I'm starting to think Siamese are a mix of Khmer and Thai blood, but in general terms, Siamese is another way to say Thai People.
I hope to adds some more thoughts in, but right now I feel like sleeping, so congratz on all your interesting thoughts.
You make some good arguments, and somehow I'm starting to think Siamese are a mix of Khmer and Thai blood, but in general terms, Siamese is another way to say Thai People.
I hope to adds some more thoughts in, but right now I feel like sleeping, so congratz on all your interesting thoughts.
Let me clarify that for you bro. Lanna is a lao state continueing from Lawangkarnchakara.th. . The Lawa was pushed down to the central area of Thailand by the lao people. The Lawa people later in a different time period created a kingdom called Lawo. This land of Lawo eventually became part of Angkor . Lawangkarnchakarath started in the year 698 AD. This is the beginning of the lao dynasty. All the lao kings has the name lao before their names. We also called this Lawa Xieng lao. The two state that was created from Lawa Xieng lao ( lawa jieng lao prounced in the past by lao people) was Lanna and Lanxang. When Mengrai was the king of this kingdom before he defeated and took the Mon peoples land. When Mengrai made Jieng Mai is captial , the kingdom name was changed to Lanna. Fa ngum was the grandson of Mengrai and he created lao lanxang to continue on with the lao dynasty. So Lanna was really created long before Sukhothai.
Sukhotai was a mixture of khmer and lao . The people that populate this kingdom of Sukhothai was the khmer, Ai lao people since time Funan and the tai that migrated south from Nanchaos destruction. Living north of Funan was liao nan/ ai lao city. These Ai lao people migrated down to south Asia almost 2000 years ago or even longer. The Ai lao state then got taken over by the khamu kingdom north of Funan.
After Sukhothai , the kingdom of Siam Ayodhaya was the creation lao rulers taking over the khmer land and khmer people. The tai that were mix with them are the upper class ruling power. Almost the whole kingdom were of Mon/ khmer people. The minority were Malay, Lawa, lahu, tai(lao) and so on. Siam or Siem , or Syam is what lao people called the khmer people that was ruled by the lao king of Ayodhaya. Thats the central Thai people. The mordern day khmer people still refer to the Central Thai Siem. They are still khmer to me.
Even thou the Ai lao state north from Funan was established before Lanna( continueing for Lawa Xieng lao ) , Lanna was considered the first lao state in Southeast asia. Thats because it was a power state that stated in 698 AD. That makes Lanna the kingdom that was born before Sukhothai.
QUOTE(lemongrass @ May 11 2007, 03:47 AM) [snapback]2936636[/snapback]
I notice that there are no Thai people engaging in this conversation at all except GraceJao. Where are the Thai scholars and warriors? In my opinion, the art of boxing is shared by Cambodia, Thailand and Laos. Why can't it be call something else besides Mauy Thai. Why can't it be called Freestyle Boxing? Khmer people don't call it Prodal Khmer but chose to call it Prodal Serey (Freestyle Boxing). It was a gift to all who practice the art not be exclusive by one country or people.
People should shut this thread down because it is an old argument that goes nowhere and it annoyed everyone.
People should shut this thread down because it is an old argument that goes nowhere and it annoyed everyone.
i wonder if alot of thai posters here are luk-kreung and chinese-thai. anyways, they would most likely not care about the past and would much rather focus on other issues and the future. i think they should just call it Muay.
look at this topic, we're talking about muay thai orign, and some poeple here keep stupidly arguing with word..
trash can topic
trash can topic
QUOTE(babyshanker @ May 11 2007, 05:19 PM) [snapback]2937796[/snapback]
i wonder if alot of thai posters here are luk-kreung and chinese-thai. anyways, they would most likely not care about the past and would much rather focus on other issues and the future. i think they should just call it Muay.
Oops, I forgot to include myself. I am Thai too (not Tai, but Khmer/Siem), just incase people don't realize that.
QUOTE(DJTherkTrei @ May 10 2007, 11:01 PM) [snapback]2935986[/snapback]
Sorry to correct you, but I believe Lanna actually came a couple more years after Sukothai.
You make some good arguments, and somehow I'm starting to think Siamese are a mix of Khmer and Thai blood, but in general terms, Siamese is another way to say Thai People.
I hope to adds some more thoughts in, but right now I feel like sleeping, so congratz on all your interesting thoughts.
You make some good arguments, and somehow I'm starting to think Siamese are a mix of Khmer and Thai blood, but in general terms, Siamese is another way to say Thai People.
I hope to adds some more thoughts in, but right now I feel like sleeping, so congratz on all your interesting thoughts.
Jao, Korp Jai Jao, thanks for the clearification, i'm still in the process of learning
QUOTE(cambosoup @ May 11 2007, 12:39 AM) [snapback]2936214[/snapback]
Mman for the record siem is what us khmers call thai people. Ask any khmer they will tell you that. And is it just me or most thai's I encountered are dark skinned (I thought they came from s. china). Don't let the media in Thailand fool you.
I dont think most ppl realize that there is a lot of miss-information out there,
just because ppl say, doesnt make it so,
most thais, as well as most Laos ppl think that Siamese are T'ai orgin too, but i believe that most of us just have the wrong information, just my personal opinion base on what i have seen so far
u just said most thais are dark skin, but on record, according too all ancient historical documents, T'ais are refered too as light skinned ppl, So then how are the dark skin Siamese descendents of the T'ais?
if ppl from Lanna would never think of calling ourselves Siamese, then where did Siamese come from, what is their origin?
we just got many examples that, the ancient Siamese Manuscripts are writtenand spocken in Khmer, I hope that will shed some light, i think most ppl are just hearing this for the first time, i know its hard to adjust ones thinking, but i hope with the increasing evidence, we can all just understand each other,
No disrespect to any khmer people. To me Muay Thai is an khmer fighting art but since the central Thai are khmer descent tai that means Muay Thai also belongs to Thai too. I think both group of people that has khmer blood should be able to claim it.
QUOTE(chanfong @ May 11 2007, 10:11 PM) [snapback]2938498[/snapback]
No disrespect to any khmer people. To me Muay Thai is an khmer fighting art but since the central Thai are khmer descent tai that means Muay Thai also belongs to Thai too. I think both group of people that has khmer blood should be able to claim it.
But does it have to be Thai. Why can't it be something nuetral. We called it prodal serey(freestyle boxing); we don't call it prodal Khmer eventhought we were the founder.
QUOTE(lemongrass @ May 11 2007, 10:19 PM) [snapback]2938517[/snapback]
But does it have to be Thai. Why can't it be something nuetral. We called it prodal serey(freestyle boxing); we don't call it prodal Khmer eventhought we were the founder.
lolz.. Khmer should have introduce it to the world before Thailand did. If Khmer introduced it first then it might have been called that. Why can't it just be Muay Thai since the Siamese are khmer people speaking the tai language anyways, eventhought alot of them in Bangkok are now part Chinese or White. This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.